This week I joined Global Methodist Church Elder Jeffrey Rickman on his PlainSpoken podcast to discuss church planting – or the lack of – in cities by not just the Global Methodist Church, but also the broader pan-Wesleyan family including Free Methodists, The Church of the Nazarene, The Wesleyan Church, and others.
Earlier this month I published a piece highlighting the lack of urban church planting by Wesleyan Christians in America. Methodist/Wesleyan new church plants are absent in Washington DC, despite’s scores of new church plants by other traditions. I noted how difficult it is to find pioneering young pastors to reach urban people.
Both the Anglican Church in North America and the Presbyterian Church in America, significantly smaller denominations than Global Methodism, have prioritized urban church planting. Why aren’t Wesleyans?
In this segment below, Rickman and I discuss this pan-Wesleyan failure:
Downloadable podcast audio of this episode is available on iTunes here.
More from IRD:
Doug Wilson Plants in DC; Methodism Shuns DC
Anglican Church Planting Success
Church Planting Interview: Glenn Hoburg of Grace DC
Comment by Colin Ross on July 31, 2025 at 9:32 am
In the words of Captain Kirk, “what does god need a starship for anyway?”
Like the Episcopal church and really all of the mainline, their age is over. How much good could be done in the world if all this money going to ceremonies, buildings, and giant expensive national organizations went to actual charity.
Lets face it, the clergy have as much factual information about the afterlife as my Stafford terrier. Its not meant to be mean but practical. After all I’m not the one who did the big rugpull many denominations did on their own churches. The episcopal church USA was founded in 1967 in an organizational structure straight out of mad men (complete with a corporate HQ skyskrapper on 2nd avenue. Yet when these churches far older than this org get closed down, the money and property doesnt get decided on by the congregation. The money is absorbed into the leviathan. This is what the methodist split is really about despite the surface reason being boomers still arguing about gay marriage while the country burns.
I was heavily inspired by a bishop John Shelby Spong. He basically laid out that the theology is dead so its all about the mission the churches want to be remembered for. Thats why in his book Why Christianity has to change or die, he outlined ways to basically shutdown the national branches and focus as much on feeding, housing, and helping people anyway they can. Christians dont like it but when the churches are going to close anyway maybe its best not to leave their legacy in the hands of a very small conclave of unelected bishops who did nothing while they destroyed their own churches.
Comment by Corvus Corax on July 31, 2025 at 2:09 pm
Hey Colin, we have organizations that feed, house, and help people on a generally secular basis. They’re called charities. You might be scandalized to learn that they also own office buildings and are governed by corporate hierarchy.
Aside from this, metaphysics do in fact matter. Rituals of connection matter. Worship matters. You wryly note that “the country burns” alongside your other observations about the decline of churches and the death of theology. Do you ever get curious if there’s some correlation at play? Did Captain Kirk have anything to say on that point?
Comment by Colin Ross on July 31, 2025 at 3:26 pm
Oh yes I do, Christians in a desperate last grasp are trying to cement their silly religion into our laws even more. Its pretty pathetic. As if shoving the ten commandments down children throats will make them believe in blood magic. Barry Goldwater warned that the preachers would destroy the Republican party and he was only too right.
As far as fictional characters go Captain Kirk was much smarter than the god of the bible. Not to mention a far more moral person that makes yaweh look like an angry, attention seeking child.
Comment by Glenn Wheeler on August 1, 2025 at 12:24 am
Spong is an atheist, a non-believer. The fact that he operates from within a mainline denomination in order to soak up money from that denomination tells you all you need to know about him and also tells you who his master is.
Be cautious about paying attention to what someone says when they’re only operating for money and name recognition.
Comment by Colin Ross on August 1, 2025 at 6:44 am
Sure but before that he was a member of the clergy his whole life and in the last 20 years or so he spoke out heavily against the Episcopal church overhead. If the episcopal church listened they might not but such a tiny shadow of its former self. Even its own (very) optimistic estimates say the church wont have anyone after 2040.
Funny, how do I tell which preachers (all of them are beggars and the most useless people in society) are just operating for money and name recognition? All ministries should be more accurately referred to as businesses. Im pretty sure the Jesus of the bible if he was anything like the non eyewitnesses said, he would have flipped a great many tables if he walked into any mainline protestant church in America. Modern American Christians are the last people who would follow a Palestinian Jew telling them to give all their money away.
Comment by Different Steve on August 1, 2025 at 7:39 am
The question of whether Jesus was “Palestinian” depends heavily on what you mean by “Palestinian” — the term can refer to modern national identity, geographic origin, or historical context.
1. Historically speaking
Jesus was born and lived in Roman-occupied Judea and Galilee, in what is now Israel and the Palestinian territories. At that time:
The region was not called “Palestine” in everyday use.
It was referred to by the Romans as Judea, Galilee, Samaria, and other such provinces.
The term “Palestine” was imposed more widely by the Romans after the Bar Kokhba revolt in 135 CE, about a century after Jesus’ death, as a way to de-Judaize the region. They renamed the province Syria Palaestina.
So, by historical terminology:
> Jesus was a Jewish man from Judea, not a “Palestinian” in the Roman or modern sense.
—
2. Modern geopolitical or cultural usage
Some people today — especially in political or activist contexts — may refer to Jesus as “Palestinian” to emphasize:
That he lived in what is now the West Bank or Israel.
That he was a non-Western, colonized person.
Or to assert that Jesus would have identified with the plight of today’s Palestinians.
But this is anachronistic:
> There was no concept of a Palestinian national identity in the 1st century CE.
—
3. Ethnically and religiously
Jesus was:
Ethnically Jewish
Religiously Jewish
Linguistically an Aramaic speaker (possibly with some Hebrew and Greek)
Culturally rooted in 1st-century Judaism in Roman-occupied territory
—
Bottom Line:
Historically and ethnically, Jesus was a Galilean Jew.
Calling him “Palestinian” in a modern sense is political and symbolic, not historically accurate
Comment by Tim Mc on August 1, 2025 at 9:02 am
Colonel Travis at the Alamo at one point said, “Men choose today whether you will stay and fight or to leave.” Maybe that is a true story and maybe it is not, but each man did have to decide whether he would stay or leave.
Joshua when leading the Israelites said, “And if it seem evil unto you to serve the Lord, choose you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the Lord.”
So today, each of us has to decide who we will serve. Yes, the church (Catholic, Protestant, Orthodox) has issues, they all could do better at many things. There are also men and women who are wolves in sheeps clothing in the church. We all know this.
So even with all the faults we have, me and my family will continue to serve the Lord God almighty, creator of heaven and earth.
Comment by Colin Ross on August 1, 2025 at 9:57 am
Right….and what did Joshua do to those who he deemed non believers? Oh thats right he pillaged, raped and sacked the towns down to the livestock. What a noble man of god. Good news is there isnt any archeological evidence that or the exodus took place.
Also it seems most of the christian replies to non Christians have something to do with us burning in hell. Most of us in America were raised in the church and many like me left in disgust. Most seemed to just wander off as not a single preacher can answer the question “Got any proof.”
Comment by Glenn Wheeler on August 1, 2025 at 4:00 pm
Colin,
You are obviously disgusted with organized religion. I can understand that. Many of the points you make are valid. But keep in mind that what you are rightly disgusted with is what people have made Christianity into, man-made doctrines.
You can, if you choose, look beyond the mess of organized Christianity, which is a collection of many, many different belief systems, each of which holds itself out to be “true” Christianity. You can also look beyond the vituperative writings from those like Spong whose goal is to destroy religion. If you do that, you might find some kernels of truth buried beneath the mountains of rubbish.
“Open my eyes that I may see glimpses of truth….place in my hand that wonderful key that shall unclasp and set me free.” If you can identify which ancient version of Christianity that quote reflects, you might be on your way to a much deeper understanding than either the “you’re gonna burn in hell” crowd or the Spongs.
Comment by Tim Mc on August 1, 2025 at 4:32 pm
Oh my Jesus, forgive us our sins, save us from the fires of Hell, lead all souls to Heaven, especially those in most need of thy mercy, Amen.
Comment by Td on August 4, 2025 at 10:21 am
Uhhhh….i don’t really understand why the UMC would be “planting churches ” in exactly the same areas where they are closing them.
Comment by Td on August 5, 2025 at 8:57 am
Colin- just to be clear…the canaanites were to be killed because what they practiced was abominable to God-
Child sacrifice
Sodomy
Ritual rape
And…these are exactly the things that Israel found themselves caught up in after they conquered the land. And then God sent the assyrians and the babylonians in to conquer Israel and Judah to clean their hearts. And then eventually his Son.
Comment by Glenn Wheeler on August 6, 2025 at 12:32 am
But, Td, did it work? Was it effective?
We both know the answer.
Comment by Td on August 6, 2025 at 9:03 am
Glenn- it’s not my place to question or judge god. But after the exile, the israelites returned with, yes, an improved commitment to follow God’s commandments. In fact, they developed a system that was meticulous about it- a situation that simply did not exist before the exile.
Comment by Glenn Wheeler on August 6, 2025 at 9:50 pm
Td
You need to read the book of Malachi. They never followed God. They always went their own way and worshipped multiple and various deities. The idea that they did not do those things is a Christian fantasy created mostly in the 20th century.