“We Must Apply Politics to Religion” NC Congressman Tells PCUSA

The Presbyterian Church (USA) Mission Agency has published a second video in their “Faith & Politics” series. The  director of the Presbyterian Church (USA) Office of Public Witness, the Rev. Jimmie Hawkins, interviewed U.S. Congressman and Yale Divinity School graduate David Price (D-NC).

Topics of discussion centered upon social justice, primarily racial integration, and Price’s background in the small Tennessee town of Irwin.

Price grew up a member of the Christian Church (Disciples of Christ) in the 1940s and 50s. As he says, he “reached maturity during the Civil Rights movement.” Because he matured during this period, he says, he was caught up in the movement, which resulted in a lot of social and politic re-thinking, prompting him to cross the partisan aisle from right to left.

Price said that the Civil Rights Movement showed him his Christian background was insufficient; he needed to care for those less fortunate and focus less on “individual selfishness.” This was his entry point into the Social Gospel.

During Price’s undergraduate years at the University of North Carolina-Chapel Hill, he became President of the Baptist Student Union (still as a Disciples member), and worked with a “progressive Baptist church” that was “aimed at social justice and racial inclusion.” He was inspired to go to Yale Divinity School “as an intellectual matter.” A “Trial Year” Fellowship was offered to Price, a year to try seminary gratis, and he accepted. Although Price decided ministry was not for him, he stayed because the education was “very good.”

Price’s direct involvement in the civil rights politics of the 1950s and 60s manifested in picketing theaters alongside religious groups to pressure the businesses to integrate. He deemed this his “first interfaith event.” Because picketing was a relative success, Price was encouraged to work in politics. Three years later, working as a summer intern in the U.S. Senate, Price personally saw the Civil Rights Act of 1964 pass the Senate. The congressman believed the Civil Rights Movement “really was a movement,” because he saw it change people’s hearts and minds.

From the racial homogeneity of Irwin, TN, to the charged atmosphere of Chapel Hill, to Price’s district in North Carolina today, race relations have improved.

Hawkins asked Price to describe the racial climate today. Price answered with a cliché, if still unfortunately correct: it is hard to generalize today, but, while we have “lots of work” to do, the situation has improved. In Price’s Research Triangle region of North Carolina, he assessed, politics is integrated, without tokenism or condescension. Hawkins mentioned that he went to a segregated school for five years of his early academic career. Moreover, in 1976, his local movie theater was still segregated. Since actual segregation was illegal by that point, the segregation to which Hawkins refers was most likely culturally-understood segregation.

Segueing into the modern intersection of politics, religion, and science. Hawkins argued that there is “no conflict” between faith and science. Price adamantly agreed, and bemoaned a “lack of a dialogue” between the two. There is, he said, common ground: immigration and “stewardship of the Earth,” for example, are areas where faith and politics should agree. Overlap between them stem from faith’s moral imperative, Price added. Both Hawkins and Price agreed that any validity of faith that depends on belief in the Earth being five thousand years old is not ideal.

Moving from faith and science to the LGBTQ+ issue, Hawkins alleged that people of faith were degrading homosexuals during a recent Supreme Court case. Price also bemoaned the treatment of homosexuals, citing Matthew chapter 25: “I was a stranger, and you invited me in.” It contrasts the basic tenets of the Bible. Price added that it is not easy to apply politics to religion, but it is important.

The final question Hawkins had for Price went back to the founding. What, he asked, do you say to people who support the separation of church and state, but who don’t like politics? Price’s answer confirmed his belief in the importance of the “vital principle” of disestablishmentarianism. The foundation of that belief is the desire to protect the state from the church, not the church from the state. Whether the church endangers the state today is another question; regardless, the separation of church and state idea originated in order to save the state. Price argued that one’s faith must inform politics: “You either live out your faith everywhere, or you don’t.” He added, “Faith does not allow discrimination,” without expanding on that statement. Price’s ending exhortation was a call to action: passivity is not an option. Different people are involved in different ways: some more, some less. All people of faith, though, must “act in the political arena.”

The video can be viewed in its entirety here.