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October 27, 2014

Southern Baptists’ Surprising Tones Towards Sexuality

Long before the start of the Southern Baptist Convention’s Ethics & Religious Liberty Commission’s 2014 (ERLC 2014) conference on marriage, sexuality and homosexuality, the fiery darts were thrown. Cultural and religious analysts and Twitter pundits alike hurled their accusations of hatred and bigotry with the hopes internet bullying would silence discussions of biblical sexuality. But had critics waited to watch the ERLC 2014 live stream, they might have been surprised by the Southern Baptists’ compassionate, almost self-deprecating opening notes.

“When we come to an event like this we have to have our hearts broken, not about their sin but about ours,” said Dr. Albert Mohler, President of Southern Baptist Theological Seminary and ERLC 2014’s opening keynote speaker. Mohler even shared, “I repent of denying that sexual orientation was legitimate.”

During the first panel discussion moderated by Phillip Bethancourt, topics covered beyond same-sex marriage included divorce and cohabitation. But one of the most compassionate statements made was directed at the Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, and Transgender (LGBTQ) community when Dr. Russell Moore, President of the ERLC, recognized the LGBTQ youth kicked out of their parents’ homes as a human dignity issue and the called on the Church to step in and care for these homeless LGBTQ youth in need.

Though displaying a compassionate tone, opening notes were not deficient of moral, biblical truths.

“It is a slander against the gospel for us to redefine sin in any way,” explained Dr. Mohler. To the Twitterverse’s surprise (had they watched), Mohler did not direct his statement solely at the topic of same-sex sexual sin. He applied this biblical truth to the consequences of the sexual revolution and couples’ decimation of the sanctity of marriage, explaining, “The divorce revolution has done far more damage to marriage than same-sex marriage will ever do.”

With a continued tone of compassion and truth, Mohler encouraged all Christians to not judge their same-sex attracted neighbors. He recounted I Corinthians 6:11 which states, “And such were some of you. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.”

He concluded, “We really do know what the Bible teaches. What we’re trying to figure out is how to apply that in this time.”

After hearing that faithful Christians cannot redefine sin and must engage the culture without becoming a part of it, what should be done? Mohler’s answer: lots of prayer and lots of “agonizing conversations” with a sense of urgency because “we can’t’ take a hiatus from history. It’s too late.”


53 Responses to Southern Baptists’ Surprising Tones Towards Sexuality

  1. greenpointguy says:

    Big, big flaw in the “sin is sin” argument: Hetero “sinners” get to stay in their moral, monogamous, loving marriages, while homo “sinners” do not get to stay in theirs. Not fair or equal at all.

    • John Thomson says:

      You don’t have a marriage without a man and woman.

      Duh.

      Also, no such thing as “loving monogamous” marriages for homosexuals. They just use each other for sex, marriage is about much more than sex.

      • greenpointguy says:

        Gee, thanks for the clarification, John. I guess the man I’ve commited myself to for life (for better or worse), with whom I have a son and a beautiful family life full of friends family and joy, is just some I “use for sex”.

        Now that it’s clarified, I can throw my life on the trash heap and get back to sexin’!!!

        • ken says:

          Two men cannot produce a son together, that is biologically impossible. No child ever born on earth has two “moms” or two “dads.” There can be no “gay family” that is equal to a normal family. Genetically, “gay family” is an oxymoron.

          • MarcoPolo says:

            Congratulations, ken!
            You revealed a primary point in human reproduction…. but the heart of this subject isn’t about procreation.

            Consider that there are many couples who marry without the intention, or capability to reproduce. Are they NOT married?

            Thank God our Constitution is evolving to accommodate the diversity of it’s adherents!
            EQUALITY… a precious covenant in our national pride.

          • greenpointguy says:

            Well, I’m having the time of my life living in a love-infused oxymoron!!

        • DD says:

          If you’re like the typical “couple,” you define “commitment” as “splitting the utility bills.” Christians don’t live in a bubble, the word about gay “relationships” is common knowledge. Call it a marriage, but have the morals of two alleycats – that is just plain wrong.

          • greenpointguy says:

            Thanks, John, for defining “typical” for me. Now I no longer have to be monogamous. Sad, though, because I really enjoyed the bond our monogamy brought…

      • mbarker12474 says:

        While homosexuality and homosexual marriage have many, many attributes of dysfunction, unhealthiness, societal flaw, etc., the assertion that they cannot be “loving monogamous” is not one of them.
        This is NOT one of the arguments to be held in our quiver of talking points, as it is factually incorrect.

        • Namyriah says:

          Never argue with science.
          If “committed relationships” existed to any extent among homosexuals, then logically there would be lower rates of AIDS and other STDs in places like San Francisco, Key West, etc, places where “couples” are affirmed by the population at large. But the STD rates are NOT lower there – sorta suggests that gays’ concept of “monogamy” is rather different from hetereosexuals. “Open marriage” is an oxymoron. True, the two people might say “We’re both OK with it.” But whether they’re “OK with it” it or not, it ain’t no marriage. You don’t sleep around when you love someone, especially when you can bring home viruses to share. That is not love, that is selfish hedonism.

      • MarcoPolo says:

        Dear, John Thomson,

        Have you not been paying attention?
        I must wonder how anyone can believe such nonsense, as you have just declared.

        But your summation isn’t without some merit. As there are millions of people, both homosexual AND heterosexual, who use one another for sex only.

        The “Marriage” contract is far more complex than your standards allow.

      • MarcoPolo says:

        YES! Marriage is much more than sex!
        So why deny those loving individuals who seek the same sanctity that you seek?

    • Josif says:

      I don’t agree with John entirely. However, a marriage is supposed to be an earnest, meaningful commitment between two people who care about each other. Sex is not necessary to have this sort of relationship. So, when sex is removed from the equation a marriage is just an important commitment to care about someone. And ultimately gay folks can engage in this relationship as can and do many straight people. In Western Culture we have replaced God and morality with humanism and hedonism. With our new gods, sexual satisfaction is the highest deity and all relationships are measured by their sexual fulfillment. God gives everyone infinitely more meaning and care than pleasure.

    • Josif says:

      Also, hetero sinners are strongly encouraged to leave their sin and Mohler speaks to that effect.

    • Jeremiah Henson says:

      So true! I’m in a polygamous marriage and Christ is telling me I can only be married to one? Not fair or equal…I should be able to love as many as I want to! (Being sarcastic here)
      All are called to repent of all sins regardless of my feelings about the sin. My cousin just died of HIV. How could I love others like him and endorse such a deadly behavior? Deadly physically and spiritually?

      • mbarker12474 says:

        By the way… the several recent court decisions have opened the legal path to polygamous marriage by their use of equal protection reasoning.
        And the “love” argument used so often by the other side takes away whatever reasoning they might have had for denying sexual love with multiple partners and with children.

        • MarcoPolo says:

          Worry not… the day of polygamous marriage will never arrive.
          You all worry about stuff that matters not!

        • Karmasue says:

          Is there even a single verse in either the Old or the New Testament that prohibits polygamy?

          • Julene Devoe says:

            Yes.
            Read the Bible. If you don’t own one, you can access several translations online for free.

          • Karmasue says:

            So you don’t know. Well I will tell you. No. There is no prohibition of polygamy in the bible…no matter which version you ascribe to.

            In fact Ex 21:10 even describes the manner in which a first wife should be treated when a second wife is taken: “If he takes him another wife; her food, her clothing, and her duty of marriage” “shall he not diminish.”

            So it was even tacitly endorsed, except in the case of the Kings and church elders, who relied on concubines for their needs.

      • MarcoPolo says:

        Love, regardless!

      • greenpointguy says:

        So how is it I’ve been out of the closet and sexually active for 20 years (prior to my monogamous marriage) without getting HIV? I mean if gay = HIV, what’s going on?

    • Cindy Coletti says:

      It’s not a humanly given guideline. God tells us what is good and acceptable to him. We do not necessarily like his holiness.

  2. brookspj says:

    I hope that from here on, before posting or endorsing anything related to ex-gay therapy, the IRD will remember that Albert Mohler has formally repented ever declaring sexual orientation illegitimate and a matter of choice.

  3. MM says:

    If a philanderer or a pedophile was “outed” in the church, how would you treat him? Remember, now, he is sexually oriented to those proclivities.
    We have bought into the “just a different flavor preference” argument when it comes time to homosexuality. “Yes,” you say, “it’s a sin — but golly they really do like each other.”
    Most men desire other (multiple) women. And there’s a fairly large minority of women who desire, from time to time, another man. Should we have compassion and coddle these people as they struggle through their multiple-sex partner attractions? It’s called temptation, and we teach them (and ourselves) to resist the temptation.
    The homosexual is no different in that regard. Yes, the etiology of their sin attraction is different than the hetero fornicator/adulterer, but so what? Does the etiology somehow give them a higher standing for “compassion?”

  4. mbarker12474 says:

    Something to keep in mind:
    “The divorce revolution has done far more damage to marriage than same-sex marriage will ever do.”
    This is a true statement and something for our side to keep in perspective as we debate the allies of homosexuality and same-sex marriage.
    We must similarly hold in view the sexual sins of cohabitation, adultery, teen-teen sex, sex as entertainment, normalization of lust inside and outside of marriage, etc. We have normalized and legitimized all these things in recent decades (in the U.S. and west), and the simple math of 99% heterosexuality means that each of these, more or less, has greater consequences (in raw numbers) than the acceptance of homosexuality.
    When debating the other side, we must not place homosexuality on some sort of island of stand-alone sin, detached from all other forms of sexual sin and sexual passions serving at distractions form God.
    Homosexuality, with its “yuck” factor and biological, plumbing issues, does carry its unique set of criticisms, and its unique set of consequences to the sinner. But we will not convince the other side that homosexuality is wrong unless we also convince the other side that all the other forms of sexual passion (and its underlying focus on self and self-attention and self-gratification) outside of traditional, monogamous, lifetime, restricted, man-woman marriage are unhealthy (to our secular friends) and unGodly (to our liberal Christian and Jewish friends).

    • MM says:

      Well said. Thank you.

    • MarcoPolo says:

      Who didn’t want to f*ck everything when they were a teenager?

      Sexual gratification isn’t something that one needs to sequester to those that are “Married”.

      And when the world realizes that marriage isn’t just for those wishing to procreate, we’ll find life a lot more tolerable.

  5. End Time Observer says:

    It would be interesting to know the contextual meaning of the following comment in the article under review: Mohler even shared, “I repent of denying that sexual orientation was legitimate.”

  6. Walhei says:

    But homosexuality is a different sin. We cannot put it into a category with other sins. Why? Because it goes against the very creation of mankind. Homosexuality goes against God’s created order.
    Also, homosexuality is a particularly unclean life style. Many CDC reports, and reports from various Health Institutions, prove, homosexual activities, sex, leads to disease. Worst, the New York Chief Health officer, a few years ago, stated; Many new strains of existing diseases are being incubated in the homosexual community.
    Last but not least, is the lie that people are born homosexual. Homosexual are made through experiences in homosexual sex. Our sexual orientation can, rather, easily be changed, through acts of homosexual sex.
    That is why children, who have not developed a strong gender identity are so vulnerable. The younger the more impressionable and vulnerable they are.
    Many homosexuals were made that way as such a young age, they do not recall the experience. But the bodies very strong sexual emotions have been imprinted by the act.
    We do not need to persecute homosexuals, But neither should we help them seduce others into that dangerous lifestyle.
    Stay the course. Educate people about that lifestyle, about how, homosexuals act during sex. It will open minds and help people to not fall victim to this false idea of equality with uncleanness.

    • MarcoPolo says:

      I’ve known relatives from the age of seven years old who throughout their lives have known themselves to be Gay.
      There were never any incidences of sexual misbehavior or contacts. So how does one determine (as you have) that homosexuality is an experienced act, and not innate?

      Your short-sightedness has blinded you!

      Ask your LGBT friends how they came to be who they are! Just ask! Nobody but you will feel queer for doing so!

      This is only my humble opinion.
      But with as much living as one might have after sixty years, there’s some degree of education to be gleaned.

      Best of luck with your position.
      MarcoPolo

    • MarcoPolo says:

      At what point, did you determine to be a heterosexual?

      • Walhei says:

        Boy and Girls are born with feminine or masculine genetic make up, and bodies. But their make up, there gender, is strengthened through out their young lives by Parents, a man and a women. Girl gravitate toward mothers, boys to fathers. They learn what it is to be a man or a woman.
        As with all things human there are always exceptions. I am speaking generally and historically. That does not mean every single case is like I described. Many factors can affect a persons gender recognition.
        Mentally handicapped mothers can dress little boys, as little girls, and mess them up, confuse them.
        We have always had perversion, homosexuals, and genetically confused people.
        The problem has been, making them prominent in the World. Focusing everyone’s attention on this small minority, as if all people are like that!
        Thanks to Democrats and others who desire to destroy America!

        • MarcoPolo says:

          Dear Walhi,

          I don’t dispute the truth you speak regarding the optimal family unit, it’s components, and their influence.
          A Man, a Woman, do make the ideal human reproductive team.

          I feel though, that there does exist, a subset to that ideal. Neutroi, is a more recent term to identify a person that is neither male or female.
          Androgynous also biologically identifies the “neutral” aspect of one’s sexuality.

          Your declaration that homosexuality is ‘learned’ or ‘taught’ through the act of sex, seems naive.
          Surely, there are individuals who have been sexually abused. Both by heterosexuals AND homosexuals, and that’s a crime, and a shame!
          However, there are probably just as many, if not more, who have come to discover their homosexuality as their gender identity, without ANY influence stemming from sexual activity…or assault!

          Personally, I don’t believe this issue of human sexual diversity, is going to destroy America, or any other civilized society. Notice I said “civilized”… That’s because these issues have been rendered hourly to every human being since we arrived on this planet.

          I respect your position on this matter, but I’d be remiss, if I didn’t attempt to offer a differing, but viable perspective. At least to better understand my fellow sojourner.

          Peace.
          MarcoPolo

  7. JBenning says:

    To all queers I have this to say……YOU may give a lot to society but your behavior sucks. Think about it. Being “gay” is not a new race of people or a “new” gender. Its still a nasty behavior. Problem is the queer “I was born this way” mantra is ineffective as trying to turn on a burned out light bulb. It won’t work. Get over it. Southern Baptist people, stand your ground! The queers want to be bend. Bend only for the one that created you…..not the idiots who what to control you. Ponder it.

    • mitchw7959 says:

      Sounds like JBenning missed the indoctrination message, but somehow I don’t think anyone at IRD really believes Rick Plasterer either.

      “While there is never an excuse for abusive language or behavior directed
      at same-sex attracted persons, the Gospel involves enormous “cost and
      blessing” for everyone.” — IRD’s Rick Plasterer

      http://juicyecumenism.com/2014/11/06/confronting-homosexuality-disciples-christ/

      • JBenning says:

        Being queer isn’t healthy and queers know that. Problem is, they want everyone to tell them everything will be ok and nothing more will happen. Gee, guess queers are not just born that way, they are born stupid to go with it. Must be that stupid gene.

        • MarcoPolo says:

          JBenning,
          Why must you display such distaste and vulgarity to your fellow man?
          Are you angry that there are people that are different than you?
          I may not agree with your language, but I’d never resort to calling you names.

          • ed-words says:

            “Vulgarity” is in the eye of the beholder. Any person with a brain would recognize that when you use another man as a semen receptacle, that would definitely qualify as “vulgar,” not to mention that it has nothing to do with love or any human emotion. I don’t think we are called upon as Christians to tiptoe around the realities of homosexuality. Men who treat each other as warm orifices to penetrate are guilty of dehumanizing each other to the max, yet people like you get on your moral high horse and scold us for “displaying such distaste and vulgarity to your fellow man.” So in your view, it’s fine for gay guys to spread lethal diseases as they sleep around with as many partners as possible, but it’s not OK to point out how they behave.

            Sorry, but telling the truth is a supremely Christian act.

          • MarcoPolo says:

            Dear Ed-words,

            Your response definitely sounds disapproving.

            But why is it, that your fixation is focused on the activity that Gays or Lesbians take part in?

            BTW, heterosexuals use one another as semen receptacles too!
            And THAT’S okay?

            LGBT issues deal with much more than the ACT of sexual gratification.
            For starters, most Gay or Lesbian relationships (if the plan is for long term) is based upon trust and respect. Like ANY other type of relationship! Like YOURS!

            So why is it, that you describe the details of such encounters as if anyone is interested in knowing such matters?

            Isn’t it more considerate to treat your fellow human beings with compassion and understanding?

            I don’t seek to make you, or anyone else to understand the nuances of human sexuality. I just think that those who feel that people who are attracted to the same sex, not be denigrated.
            There is NO reason for such behavior!

            Sincerely,
            MarcoPolo

          • JBenning says:

            MarcoPolo, queers are queers and they will never be anything else. You are not gay because you are most unhappiest of people. Get used to it. If you think for one second I’m going to pat you on the back for being an idiot, please think again cause it ain’t ever gonna happen. Get over that as well. We WILL continue to tell you that your behavior is useless, worthless and degrading to you and anyone around you. These pride parades of the queers….looks like a bunch of circus animals on the loose that need to rounded up and put back in their cages. Queers are intolerant, bigoted and not worth wiping one’s ass on. Get used to that as well. Don’t like it? Leave the queer lifestyle. And please, don’t ever try to tell me you were “born that way”. That mantra is older than shit itself.

          • MarcoPolo says:

            Thanks for that earful! I jest!
            Usually those individuals who spout such vitriol, are the ones who are struggling with such attractions.

            If in fact, you are wrestling with unusual sexual urges, I suggest you keep it a private matter between you and your therapist.

            Your previous entry deserves to be flagged, and I think it prudent that I do just that.

            Please refrain from sounding so crude?

          • JBenning says:

            Crude? Don’t like it? Leave the lifestyle.

          • MarcoPolo says:

            Yes, You are definitely angered at something.

            Funny thing, you seem so angered by the LGBT issue, that you’re presuming that even I am Gay!
            Not that there’s anything wrong with that! Because if I were Gay, I’d be just as vigilant in defending myself, and my (as you put it, “lifestyle”).

            One doesn’t have to throw away ANYTHING or ANYBODY to be true to themselves.
            Only frightened ‘straight’ people believe such stuff!

            Why would a loving family (as I presume yours to be) wish to discard, or disown one of their own family members just because they were Gay? That makes no sense!

            Earlier, I apologized for swearing on this site/thread. I’m hoping that all contributors will meter their own language as well.

            Peace, brother JBenning!

          • JBenning says:

            You just don’t get it do you? You think that you deserve a medal because you are a queer. Sorry Charlie, no not pass go, do not collect $200, don’t worry about jail, just worry about your death bed because THAT is where queerdom leads…undignified death. No one will give a crap about you. Your so called queer friends don’t care either. Know why? Cause they are too busy playing house and acting like a bunch of circus animals to have time for anything or anyone at anytime. Queers will never get it until they leave the putrid lifestyle behind. I suspect you won’t cause everything is rosy in your life. Truthfully, you haven’t a clue and never will. That is how blind you really are.

          • MarcoPolo says:

            Your aptitude on social issues is apparently above your ability to communicate in a civil manner, so I’ll avoid any further engagement with you, sir.

            I’m quite saddened that your position on this topic keeps you from experiencing Life’s bounty, and God’s grace, but I’ll pray for you anyway.

            Let us pray for your descendants that should anyone of them be Gay or Lesbian, that you will still love them.

            Peace be upon you.

          • JBenning says:

            You want someone to pat you on the back for being an idiot. Not gonna happen. If you can’t understand then you feel free to go back to screwing that sewer pipe. And don’t bother to pray for me…do so for yourself. You and in more trouble than me. My descendants will do just fine. At least they will be told the truth about queerdom and how dangerous it really is. You won’t have have descendants….two males can’t reproduce….idiot.

          • MarcoPolo says:

            You win, JBenning!
            Thanks for the advice and now we part….graciously!

          • mikeg says:

            You might as well be consistent and admit you’re OK with incest, pedophilia, polygamy, whatever. Like you said, we’re not supposed to denigrate any human being, long as they get their sexual kicks, who are we to judge?

            Pretty much means that we are just animals.

          • MarcoPolo says:

            mikeg,
            Why would it show consistency, to allow criminal behavior such as incest or pedophilia?
            Homosexuality is not a crime, although, I think many would like to make it so.

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